Next Supreme Court Justice

Discussion in 'The Swarm Lounge' started by LibertyTurns, Jul 1, 2018.

  1. LibertyTurns

    LibertyTurns Helluva Engineer

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    Do we get a conservative to replace Scalia on the court or do we get another timid neocon out of the Maniac like he did when he nominated Gorsuch? We’ve already got enough types that make the law up as they go on the court. I hope we get someone that can actually understand the Constitution as it was written & isn’t prone to how they feel that day when voting. The liberals are going to cry regardless unless the Maniac marches out the next coming of Chairman Mao, Lenin, Stalin or Marx as his nominee. The Pubs will do their old “that’s the best we could do” mantra because they’re mostly spineless bastards. We’re going to understand 100% just how far left the Maniac is with his true political leanings based on what he does here. History is not on the side of a conservative nominee.
     
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  2. MikeJackets1967

    MikeJackets1967 Helluva Engineer

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    President Trump will nominate a Conservative who is 35-45 years old who can sit on the Supreme Court for 40 years. Senator and Constitutional scholar Mike Lee is one of the potential Supreme Court Justices that President Trump is interested in.
     
  3. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    Meeeehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. As much as I'd like a Constitutional robot to sit on the court and make decisions absent any polticial leanings, I am not sure those people exist. Folks get absolutely trashed now when they are nominated, so a great many don't even want to subject their families to that anymore. If its a 'squishy' person like Gorsuch or Roberts I am totally fine with that - if its a reasonable person with a reasonable disposition that will try to stick with the Constitution more often than not, its better than who is retiring. Kennedy really seemed like someone trying to make friends half the time rather than make accurate decisions.
     
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  4. MWBATL

    MWBATL Helluva Engineer

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    Did I hear a rumor that a Susan Collins was one he was considering?

    I would be appalled.
     
  5. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    If that's true, she would be one of the worst options possible. She is the epitome of someone who bases her opinions and positions on what will get her the most friends and not what's right or wrong. I hope Trump isn't considering that as any sort of chess play either, like trying to get her out of the seat to get a more conservative person in there. She may be the best Republicans can do in the state of Maine. Count your blessings.
     
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  6. MikeJackets1967

    MikeJackets1967 Helluva Engineer

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    I'd rather have Senator Mike Lee be a Justice of the Supreme Court than Susan Collins.
     
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  7. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    I think there are 14 Democrats in the state of Utah, so that would be a safer pick if you are moving someone out of Congress.
     
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  8. OldJacketFan

    OldJacketFan Helluva Engineer

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    You far over estimate the #of Democrats in Utah :cool:

    Do y'all really want to put someone on the high court who has zero experience such as Mike Lee? I know he clerked for a former justice but that ain't the same as being on a bench. Yes I know Kagan had no prior experience on the bench but she had been previously nominated for the appellate bench and had served as solicitor general, traditionally this position has been viewed as one that grooms a person for the court of appeals or the SCOTUS
     
  9. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    That's a fair question and I didn't mean to imply he'd be my first pick. My first pick would be someone who had spent a couple decades in higher court experience. Mike Lee would be further down the list, but not far down to the Harriet Miers level. :D

    Someone with a lot of experience is valuable not just because they have the experience, but you have plenty of data to look at in terms of temperament.
     
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  10. Technut1990

    Technut1990 Ramblin' Wreck

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    Man the left is already going crazy.

    Bill Maur to Michael Moore, “ do you have any second thoughts about guns now that facisim is coming “
    Michael Moore. “ not worried about civil war if it were going to happen it would happen if Hillary won, 87% of America doesn’t own a gun, there was real concern that Trump supporters wouldn’t accept Hillary winning. If Trump had won the popular vote but lost the election they would have started a war “

    Wasn’t it Clinton media that started asking Trump if he would accept the results, only for Hillary to take 2days to study actually fighting them ? Wasn’t it and isn’t it the left who have been trying like hell to remove Trump since the day he won ?

    The left is also now concerned with precedents. Apparently they will not stand for a judge who will overturn the Roe v Wade precedent. In the mean time they have no problem with opposing precedents on gay marriage, marijuana use or anything else that they want done differently.

    These next months will define America. While I understand change happens the kind of change the extreme left wants is in fact becoming what the left stands for, in my view that spells the end of this Representative Republic.

    Despite all the words the left reminds me of Sinn Fein, As they talk peace The IRA members of their party are on the march. Yes there are extreme right wing nuts but there aren’t masss of right wingers marching in the streets, calling for government officials heads, banning them from public view, calling to eliminate ICE and undermining law enforcement in favor of criminals.

    The moderate left no longer exist we should expect real violence if Trump does what he should and appoints a conservative. Nobody will ever convince me that the left wouldnt appoint another Liberal if they were in this position.

    I fear for my country not because of Trump but because of the violence the left has shown they will employ.
     
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  11. OldJacketFan

    OldJacketFan Helluva Engineer

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    Nice of you to broad brush all of us on the left. Does it sound better if I say everyone on the right is a right wing nut job? Demonizing from both side is ridiculous and for the most part I ignore it but every now and then I just have to call it for the bulls**t it is.
     
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  12. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    We have many fine Democrats/Progressives/Liberals on these message boards. People I am happy to associate and interact with. I would remind them and anybody else that the notion of stare decisis dictates that you better have found some pretty strong legal basis for overturning a previous court decision. Personally, I'd argue that in some of the cases like Roe vs Wade and Obergefell vs Hodges its pretty clear the court created rights that don't exist in the Constitution. However, due to precedent, I also wouldn't be surprised to see a majority conservative court vote to keep those laws in place. So I don't think we should assume anything.

    Furthermore, I would remind these same friends that even if a ruling is overturned, it doesn't mean chaos would commence. Congress and/or States are still free to do their jobs and pass actual laws. If you feel that your freedom and rights are based on 1 single or a couple judges, then I'd politely tell you there is something very shaky with that. I could go into a very long post about how Congress and the states could immediately pass laws which legally and constitutionally keep gay people (for example) from losing their true constitutional rights, but that's probably better left for another thread.

    I guess that's my 2 points - 1, don't fret. Life is too short to join all the people setting themselves on fire, starting fights, and going through every day mad and outraged about something. 2, Congress and the States still have their roles to play here. And technically there is 3, that if a ruling is overturned there will probably be a very long runway given for legislators to do their job and which in the meantime could launch more lawsuits.

    EDIT: I'll add point 4 after seeing OldJacketFan's post - I know I can be guilty of provocative statements too, but lets try not to impugn too many people with broad brushes.
     
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  13. Technut1990

    Technut1990 Ramblin' Wreck

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    Old Jacket, I didn’t paint with a broad brush. You may feel offended but argue the facts I presented. It is your side who is marching and demanding these things. I pointed out that there are right wing nuts, you apparently were to offended to see that.

    The fact is, at least as far as I know, conservatives as a whole have not employed the tactics the left has. If you don’t hold these views then you shouldn’t be offended but if you doubt the tactics the left are talking about just turn on the talk shows, read the paper or follow Huff Post. There are a lot of people on your side planning civil discourse. It includes stalking Collins and Murkowski at their homes, shutting down the tourist industry to Alaska and generally harassing them before they vote. Elizabeth Warren, a leading candidate on the left proposed eliminating ICE yesterday. I clearly said the extreme left has taken over your party, the extreme right threatens the Conservative party. That statement is not a condemnation of you personally, I don’t take it as a personal comment when it’s placed on the conservatives but the facts are the facts your side, not you personally, is threatening some radical action if they don’t get their way and your side is the side whose elected officials stand by and watch towns burn as the leftist commit their acts of violence.

    If you don’t agree with the tactics that are coming then the post wasn’t about you
     
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  14. OldJacketFan

    OldJacketFan Helluva Engineer

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    I can argue every "fact" you posted but why bother, your mind is made up. None on the right in the streets? Guess you didn't see the news from Charlottesville and Portland. Guess you don't listen to Sean Hannity or read Alex Jones or Brietbart and I could go and on. Oh and BTW no one has called for the elimination of ICE and the end of police like the maniac tweeted about. What has been called for is a review and revision on ICE. Read beyond the sensational headlines, it's oft time quite educational. Oh and one other thing, what the hell is wrong with civil discourse? This country was founded on that principle.
     
  15. MikeJackets1967

    MikeJackets1967 Helluva Engineer

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    Alexandria Ocasio Cortez,Senator Kirsten Gillibrand and New York Mayor Bill De Blasio called for the elimination of ICE.................................................just sayin';)
     
  16. OldJacketFan

    OldJacketFan Helluva Engineer

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    De blasio and Gillibrand both went on to say there needed to be a revamp of immigration including ICE. Ocasio Cortez is not what I would call a leader of the left at this time ;)
     
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  17. Technut1990

    Technut1990 Ramblin' Wreck

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    Old Jacket,

    I’m pretty sure that the protest you are refferrring to were white nationalist, they weren’t card carrying members of the Republican Party. Although attempts are made to place the two together and call them one, they are not. Warren clearly stated it’s time to consider eliminating ICE as we know it. It’s her response to the immigration issue. If the Democratic Party would simply state that immigration laws will be enforced, 80% of that problem would be resolved.

    There is nothing wrong with civil discourse either but civil discourse in the manner as demonstrated in Ferguson, Charlotte and at Berkeley are not actually civil, they are violent and they are in opposition to lawful conduct and the extreme left will employ these tactics again and when they do the liberal leaders of these areas will order the police to stand down and cities, towns and buildings will burn —- like they already have.

    And you are right, my mind is made up on the lefts tactics. The lefts leaders are the ones who remain defensive of the extremist among them as they chant ‘ what do we want ? Dead cops “. I know the mindset of those who feel supported by the lefts leaders. I’ve looked them in the eyes as they throw rocks and chant death threats behind their bandanna covered faces. I see the protesters surrounding the cops house in Pennsylvania as they demand “justice” its just not justice as our system determines it.

    You will see how the left reacts and if I’m wrong I expect you to call me out but I absolutely promise you that if the democrat leaders pronounce the SC nominee to be an extremist right winger, which they will, there will be civil discourse and that discourse will turn violent when he or she is actually appointed.

    I apologize to you for saying this in a manner that makes you feel attacked. I really do ! I don’t mean to attack moderate or mainstream democrats in a personal way. I don’t associate anyone participating in this board to be extremist, certainly not you. I do expect all of us to keep the basic thought of democracy in our minds as we talk. In this case democracy brought us Trump and it’s going to bring us his appointee. You and I know what that means for civil discourse.
     
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  18. RonJohn

    RonJohn Helluva Engineer

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    Republicans aren't very good at appointing justices who continue to vote in the way the Republicans think they will. O'Connor, Souter, and to some extent Kennedy are examples of that.
     
  19. OldJacketFan

    OldJacketFan Helluva Engineer

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    Here is what Elizabeth Warren actually said,

    Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren on Saturday called for US Immigration and Customs Enforcement to be replaced with an agency that reflects America's morality and "that works," joining the growing chorus of Democrats who have called for the agency to be scrapped.n (emphasis added)

    https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/30/politics/elizabeth-warren-ice-immigration-protests/index.html

    The right cannot run way from its association for the white nationalist and assorted alt right groups, see Steve Bannon and Sebastian Gorka for example and we won't go to the even more radical components.

    Ferguson, Charlotte and other vocal, in your face demonstrations reflect a frustrated, marginalized populace. When the boil over to rioting law enforcement should do their job but to gripe simply because they are in your face is ignoring the underlying, on going issues. I'm not sure why your lumped Berkley in with these, other than to talk about the left fed up with hate speech from the alt right and it's representatives. I don't condone such and most of the folks I know don't. I am quite capable of shutting up a RWNJ without having to punch his lights out.

    If the dear leader appoints someone who is part of the radical right I fully expect and will participate in protest of the nominee, that is my right as a citizen.
     
  20. bwelbo

    bwelbo Helluva Engineer

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    What is ICE doing wrong that they shouldn’t be doing?
     
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