NCAA's Treatment of Women
- Thread starter lauraee
- Start date
Deleted member 2897
Guest
I mean, it’s a good fire note, and the NCAA had no excuse for not providing adequate facilities. But the last time I looked, the men’s teams brought in 30x what the women’s teams brought in. $1B/yr vs $35m/yr. Not sure where she gets her half a billion number from. The NCAA actually loses money on the women’s tournament.
LibertyTurns
Banned
- Messages
- 6,216
I can see how people might think this is a good thing but be careful of the boomerang effect. We have a pending lawsuit which among other things each side is lobbing at each other is disparity of treatment between men’s & women’s team’s. In essence she took an indirect shot at the hand that feeds her, maybe not what she intended but life’s full of unintended consequences. Stansbury & Cabrera need to help help navigate thru this.
GTZachary
Jolly Good Fellow
- Messages
- 234
This is what I could find on the subject:
“While it doesn’t generate anything close to the men’s tournament, the women’s tournament does bring in revenue, mainly through its own TV rights. The NCAA has a 14-year, $500 million deal with ESPN that covers a wide-ranging series of championships, including the men’s basketball National Invitational Tournament, the College World Series and the women’s basketball tournament. Though it’s not broken out by event, the contract will pay the NCAA $41.8 million this year.”
So yea, the half billion number actually supports the opposite of her point.
Deleted member 2897
Guest
Ha! Well the men’s tournament will bring in about a half trillion dollars over the next 300 years.
There's an argument to be had here. But referencing how many views a TikTok video got ain’t it. There’s only but so much money you can extract from a money losing venture. What they should be doing is engaging together to expand their visibility and marketability. And yes, demanding at least some basic level of accommodations.
- Messages
- 9,899
- Location
- Oriental, NC
The real problem is that the NCAA negotiated separate contracts for men's and women's TV rights. It should have been bundled into one agreement. No one is claiming the women's tournament is worth the same as men's.
Techster
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 18,235
I think keeping them separate is actually a smart thing from the NCAA's legal perspective. It clearly defines the value of the men's assets versus the women's assets. It avoids the issue of any pay compensation disparity as a single contract for both sides could cloud the issue.
If you pay attention to what's going on with US men's and women's soccer team, the women are fighting are an equal slice of the overall pie. There's more going on with it than that, but overall, the US Soccer Federation is having to justify why men's and women's players do not get paid equally. Keeping them separate, and therefore clearly delineating income of the two sides makes the pay disparity an easier argument to defend.
RonJohn
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 4,994
What about the claims about the NCAA's non-profit status? A 501(c)(3) organization is required to use money to promote the designated charity. In the case of the NCAA that is "equipping student-athletes to succeed on the playing field, in the classroom and throughout life." There are requirements for 501(c)(3) organizations that prohibit selective funding based on revenue generation. A local amateur baseball league can't have a fundraiser and pay league dues of individual athletes based on how much fundraising that individual athlete's family did. If they sell Krispy Kreme, they cannot deduct $1 from an athlete's dues for every box that athlete sells. They could sell 10,000 boxes and deduct $10,000 worth of dues across all of the athletes. But they cannot require participation and they cannot reward participation. Doing so can have the 501(c)(3) status revoked.
What are the complaints in Fortner's post? A nod to the social media posts about weight facilities, questions about branding on the floors, and disparities in COVID testing. Why would the NCAA believe that women do not need weight facilities? Maybe women do work out differently and need different equipment, but one rack of dumbbells is in no way acceptable. If the women's tournament brings in $40-$50 million, why can't the floors be covered with adequate branding so that people know that it is the NCAA tournament? The UTSA floor that GT played on yesterday was covered with volleyball and maybe some other markings. If I didn't know that I was watching the NCAA tournament before putting that channel on, I would not have been able to tell easily once the picture was on the screen. $40-$50 million is plenty to provide a floor covering. Why is there any difference whatsoever in the COVID testing protocols? Are women student athletes and women's coaches health not a concern?
- Messages
- 15,708
Deleted member 2897
Guest
Cabrera is not the right person to help navigate.
- Messages
- 11,490
Why? Cabrera’s response looks smart.
Deleted member 2897
Guest
What university is giving its female students worse text books or lesser meal plans? What relevance is the number of views on a TikTok video? His statement is a shallow nothing nothing.
JacketRacket
Jolly Good Fellow
- Messages
- 435
This is an inane conclusion. A president's reach is far beyond text books and meal plans. The NCAA exists because the SCHOOLS decide to be a part of it. Pressure can come from both directions.
Him echoing support for his student athletes, his coach, and recognizing the disparity is not a nothing nothing.
jacketup
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 1,551
Yeah, the NCAA screwed up--like they usually do. But this isn't a sign of a systemic problem that is worthy of some protest--it's just the NCAA screwing up again.
I haven't applied for very many jobs in my life, but I have been the victim of sexual discrimination twice. The first in 1976 and the second in 1981. In both cases I was flat out told they were going to hire a woman for the job, and in both cases they hired a lesser qualified person. So, as a victim from the other side of the table, I get tired of all this stuff---especially from the standpoint that we now have to correct the wrongs of the past. 1976 was 45 years ago, and if "reverse" discrimination hasn't worked by now, it's not going to. There are obviously other factors in play.
I haven't applied for very many jobs in my life, but I have been the victim of sexual discrimination twice. The first in 1976 and the second in 1981. In both cases I was flat out told they were going to hire a woman for the job, and in both cases they hired a lesser qualified person. So, as a victim from the other side of the table, I get tired of all this stuff---especially from the standpoint that we now have to correct the wrongs of the past. 1976 was 45 years ago, and if "reverse" discrimination hasn't worked by now, it's not going to. There are obviously other factors in play.
Deleted member 2897
Guest
His 1 sentence statement is effectively "YEA! What she said!". That as you show leads everyone to come to their own conclusion about what he means and how he feels. That's my point.
LibertyTurns
Banned
- Messages
- 6,216
Is lip service the only thing he’s going to provide or is he prepared to put his money where his mouth is?
For example is he going to demand Fortner get the same pay, pay for staff and recruiting resources/budget that Pastner gets?
His response to me was a knee jerk, shallow PR job. No commitment at all.
- Messages
- 11,490
His commitment is to do BETTER and I would expect Stansbury to be thinking the same
Fatmike91
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 1,291
- Location
- SW Florida
Either way women have been fun to watch.
Cabrera could either do nothing, disagree with Nell or agree with her. I think agreeing probably best of those options.
The women’s fan base has way more growth potential than the men’s game with the right marketing (from a much smaller base). I think Nell is a good spokesperson for the game and maybe if the NCAA listens to the criticism they will end up with a more valuable property.
I also think this is good for recruiting.
/
Cabrera could either do nothing, disagree with Nell or agree with her. I think agreeing probably best of those options.
The women’s fan base has way more growth potential than the men’s game with the right marketing (from a much smaller base). I think Nell is a good spokesperson for the game and maybe if the NCAA listens to the criticism they will end up with a more valuable property.
I also think this is good for recruiting.
/
deeznats
Jolly Good Fellow
- Messages
- 466
Who can resist a good That's What She Said?
ESPNjacket
Helluva Engineer
- Messages
- 1,531
While one can get lots of clicks ranting on social media a better strategy would be to encourage people to tune in by letting them know what great stuff they are missing.
It is the difference between short term thinking and building something for the long term. If one wants to use the first tactic and shift to the strategy, do it quickly because that attention is fleeting and the opportunity short. Now back to sports.
It is the difference between short term thinking and building something for the long term. If one wants to use the first tactic and shift to the strategy, do it quickly because that attention is fleeting and the opportunity short. Now back to sports.