Fall Camp Thread

33jacket

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I'm loving what I hear from Brant Mitchell about the attitude/drive/hustle coming out of the defense.

You play harder, when as a player, you actually believe in the strategy, scheme, system that you are being asked to do. When as a player, you think its dumb and flawed from snap one. You tend to drift.

Let you be the judge. I have been judging. ;)

Oh. And i was right. Haha.
 

dressedcheeseside

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Ice cream trucks are the first step down the slippery slope to Clemson's Adult Daycare centers. /s
:rolleyes:
You play harder, when as a player, you actually believe in the strategy, scheme, system that you are being asked to do. When as a player, you think its dumb and flawed from snap one. You tend to drift.

Let you be the judge. I have been judging. ;)

Oh. And i was right. Haha.
The jury is still out, but I'm inclined to believe you at this point.
 

tech_wreck47

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You play harder, when as a player, you actually believe in the strategy, scheme, system that you are being asked to do. When as a player, you think its dumb and flawed from snap one. You tend to drift.

Let you be the judge. I have been judging. ;)

Oh. And i was right. Haha.
Funny thing is, we could finish top 35 and it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if some posters would say it’s because they were already coached up, depth was better from recruiting etc, and that if the old staff was still here it would have been the same outcome.
 

TromboneJacket

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Funny thing is, we could finish top 35 and it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if some posters would say it’s because they were already coached up, depth was better from recruiting etc, and that if the old staff was still here it would have been the same outcome.
I think it’s more likely that we could be above average on defense, and people would still say that our defense sucks and is responsible for all of our losses.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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You play harder, when as a player, you actually believe in the strategy, scheme, system that you are being asked to do. When as a player, you think its dumb and flawed from snap one. You tend to drift.

Let you be the judge. I have been judging. ;)

Oh. And i was right. Haha.

The proof will be in the pudding. We will soon be able to judge if our defensive struggles were mostly coaching or mostly talent in nature. Maybe a little of both? Then... 33 will have bragging rights for sure.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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Yea I agree, I just don’t think we would lose very many if we were above average on D.
Had our defense been above average last year, we probably beat Miami and Duke. Where was our defense ranked last year? Seems we gave up 26 or so points a game but in this day and age that might be considered pretty decent by some. I know that in viewing games again the defense played quite well at least to my untrained eye, against North Carolina and Pittsburgh but just collapsed against Miami, UGA, and Duke. Seems like they played pretty well against Virginia Tech also. As much as some have complained about the defense last year and at times it was pretty bad nonetheless, I have seen worse, far worse, in recent years.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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Funny thing is, we could finish top 35 and it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if some posters would say it’s because they were already coached up, depth was better from recruiting etc, and that if the old staff was still here it would have been the same outcome.

I am not as inclined as some to criticize Coach Roof but saying that improvement on defense THIS YEAR is because "...they were already coach up..." Well, that might be a stretch. The attitude of the defense certainly seems changed from years past so there is that.
 

4shotB

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"Who are you going to be, are you going to run to the ball, or are you going to be one of those guys that no one really notices?"
- Mr. Brant Mitchell

Oh yeah, that is going in the sig.

That quote jumped out at me as well. Sounds like something Clint Eastwood might say. In fact, if Clint had said it the other day instead of Brant, posters would be made of it and I would probably get a tattoo of it on one of my guns. Except that at my age they really aren't guns anymore. upon further reflection, they may never have really truly ever been guns. Maybe I should refer to them as my upper arm or biceps. Biceps is still a scientifically correct for that area of my anatomy.
 

Longestday

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The defense had a 63 FEI ranking and the offense had 23 FEI and the ST had a 125 rank. 2016 it was 94, 21, 18 respectively. Defense S&P rank of 47 2017 and 57 2016. The Offense S&P was 61 2017 and 44 in 2016.

GT had a very high rating on 3rd down in 2017, but only 20% of the first downs happed on 3rd down.



 

tech_wreck47

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I am not as inclined as some to criticize Coach Roof but saying that improvement on defense THIS YEAR is because "...they were already coach up..." Well, that might be a stretch. The attitude of the defense certainly seems changed from years past so there is that.
I’m not saying that, I’m saying some might say that. (Not sure if you thought I meant that)
 

GTNavyNuke

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.......... The kicking situation does not sound positive to me.

Nope, the kicking game sounds dismal again this year from the first couple minutes of this press conference. Or as CPJ says "A little less than stellar". This year, 3 guys who aren't distinguishing themselves according to CPJ. Plotting every kick so we can pick the least worst. Last year we did have deserved ST team rating that was better than 5 teams (125 of 130). https://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/feist

I really miss Butt Kicker.

ST is once again a forgotten part of the game. It's great to have a good O and D, but if you can't make the kicks or return or cover, that's a lot to make up. If our ST are as bad as last year, we will be fortunate to make a bowl game. ST could have won 2 or 3 more games last year if we had only been average (65th).
 

Silk3

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I'm loving what I hear from Brant Mitchell about the attitude/drive/hustle coming out of the defense.
All our guys our great, but Brant really seems like a good/cool dude. Ive been upset with him some in the past about some plays I thought he should of made maybe and the book is still out on him, but I rlly hope he has a great senior year.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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The defense had a 63 FEI ranking and the offense had 23 FEI and the ST had a 125 rank. 2016 it was 94, 21, 18 respectively. Defense S&P rank of 47 2017 and 57 2016. The Offense S&P was 61 2017 and 44 in 2016.

GT had a very high rating on 3rd down in 2017, but only 20% of the first downs happed on 3rd down.




Thank you for the timely stats but what is "S&P"? Is Standard and Poor now rating college football defenses? TIC. I knew special teams were substandard last year but my goodness that is shocking. Longest Day pretty much confirms my suspicions: If the offense did not move the ball on pretty much every possession, did not score touchdowns consistently, we were in a world of hurt. The question remains: will this year see more of the same? I am praying for significant improvement on both special teams and defense because I am not confident the offense is capable of 2016 or 2014 type numbers. I think we can move the ball and score but easy touchdowns will be hard to come by.
 

Heisman's Ghost

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I think it’s more likely that we could be above average on defense, and people would still say that our defense sucks and is responsible for all of our losses.

Some might think this is a relatively recent phenomena. Au contraire, it is a Tech tradition dating back a half a century. When I was a young lad sitting with my parents at Grant Field, we were watching Tech manhandle somebody, may have been Tulane. Anyway towards the end of the first half, with Tech up by three touchdowns. Coach Dodd as was his wont kicked on third down from deep in Tech end of the field. The other team completed some passes lo and behold they scored a touchdown with just seconds left. Well, this leather lunged guy behind us in the old North Stands screams at Dodd as they are going in at half time "Damn you Dodd kicking on third down" My mother covered my ears. I asked my dad after the game which Tech, of course, won handily with no further damage why the fellow was so upset and he said that is the way some people are. If he didn't complain about that he would gripe about not passing enough or passing too much or something else. He probably had some money on the game and was a gambler. Daddy, what's a gambler? My mother glared at Dad and that was a topic left for another day.
 

slugboy

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Thank you for the timely stats but what is "S&P"? Is Standard and Poor now rating college football defenses? TIC. I knew special teams were substandard last year but my goodness that is shocking. Longest Day pretty much confirms my suspicions: If the offense did not move the ball on pretty much every possession, did not score touchdowns consistently, we were in a world of hurt. The question remains: will this year see more of the same? I am praying for significant improvement on both special teams and defense because I am not confident the offense is capable of 2016 or 2014 type numbers. I think we can move the ball and score but easy touchdowns will be hard to come by.

I know you’re just giving him a hard time, but it’s useful to know where to find these metrics. S&P and F+ are two of the better aggregate predictors out there (plus ELO and some others).
Bill Connolly explains S&P at https://www.sbnation.com/college-fo...ge-football-advanced-stats-analytics-rankings and a little more at https://www.footballstudyhall.com/2015/2/9/8001137/college-football-advanced-stats-glossary

It stands for Success and Points

On offense, it’s a combination of factors, adjusted for the opponent and factoring out garbage time. Some of those things are how often you get at least 5 yards on first down (or, on defense, give up less than that). On special teams, pinning the other team back is good and worth points.

Here is how he describes it:

FIVE FACTORS
The Five Factors are the basis for the new S&P+ ratings. They stem from the work done in this post.

But over time, I've come to realize that the sport comes down to five basic things, four of which you can mostly control. You make more big plays than your opponent, you stay on schedule, you tilt the field, you finish drives, and you fall on the ball. Explosiveness, efficiency, field position, finishing drives, and turnovers are the five factors to winning football games.

If you win the explosiveness battle (using PPP), you win 86 percent of the time.
If you win the efficiency battle (using Success Rate), you win 83 percent of the time.
If you win the drive-finishing battle (using points per trip inside the 40), you win 75 percent of the time.
If you win the field position battle (using average starting field position), you win 72 percent of the time.
If you win the turnover battle (using turnover margin), you win 73 percent of the time.
This is from 2013 college football game data. It's very, very similar from year to year.

These are good odds. And they speak to the fundamentals of football itself. You want to be efficient when you've got the ball, because if you fall behind schedule and into passing downs, you're far less likely to make a good play. You want to eat up chunks of yardage with big plays, because big plays mean both points and fewer opportunities to make mistakes. When you get the opportunity to score, you want to score. And when you give the ball back to your opponent, you want to give them to have to go as far as possible.
Aside from their impact on the new S&P+ ratings, the Five Factors will be accounted for in the 2015 season previews in 10 ways -- five adjusted for opponent, five not, and all interrelated:

Efficiency. Success Rate (unadjusted) and Success Rate+ (adjusted). As defined above, success rates examine your efficiency and consistency in staying on schedule and putting yourself in position to move the chains.

Explosiveness. IsoPPP (unadjusted) and IsoPPP+ (adjusted). IsoPPP is the Equivalent Points Per Play (PPP) average on only successful plays. This allows us to look at offense in two steps: How consistently successful were you, and when you were successful, how potent were you?

Field Position. Average Starting Field Position (unadjusted) and FP+ (adjusted). This is mostly self-explanatory, with one important note: An offense is measured by its defense's starting field position, and vice versa. Special teams obviously play a large role in field position, but so do the effectiveness of your offense and defense. So in the team profiles, you'll find Defensive Starting FP in the offensive section and Offensive Starting FP in the defensive section.

Finishing Drives. Points Per Trip Inside the 40 (unadjusted) and Redzone S&P+ (adjusted). Also mostly self-explanatory. These measures look not at how frequently you create scoring opportunities, but how you finish the ones you create. And yes, for the purposes of these stats, the "red zone" starts at the 40, not the 20.

Turnovers. Using both Turnover Margin and Adjusted Turnover Margin (as defined above), we can take a look at both how many turnovers you should have committed (on offense) or forced (on defense) and how many you actually did. This tells us a little bit about quality and a lot about the Turnovers Luck idea defined above.



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