Crazy World We Live In

MWBATL

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,793
Late to the party here, but HIPAA laws create a disconnect between the law and what happens in the real world. Those in the medical profession are not going to reach out to Law enforcement and proactively put people on the "mentally ill" list and disqualify them from firearm ownership. I had a relative who was on and off suicidal for several years, and spent time at one of the metro-Atlanta mental facilities. We requested that the doctors use whatever system they had to put this relative on "the list" and the answer was basically "Hipaa. No can do."
Gotta love. government interference. I will never be able to understand those who advocate for single payer health care, federal government control over state control, etc etc etc....simply because the central government almost always proves its incompetence at every turn.
 

4shotB

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
2,523
Gotta love. government interference. I will never be able to understand those who advocate for single payer health care, federal government control over state control, etc etc etc....simply because the central government almost always proves its incompetence at every turn.
I think the idea of it is certainly attractive on paper. I can see that. But, based on my personal experience and conversations, most who favor it do not have adequate experience dealing with the government agencies on a regular basis and really have no idea of the waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia, etc. of these agencies.
 

JacketRacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
396
I think the idea of it is certainly attractive on paper. I can see that. But, based on my personal experience and conversations, most who favor it do not have adequate experience dealing with the government agencies on a regular basis and really have no idea of the waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia, etc. of these agencies.
Unfortunately, private run payment systems have the same waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia. The healthcare revenue system is absolutely massive and bloated. I worked in that field for a few years, and it's insane how complex simple reimbursements are. Every payer has their own contacts for reimbursements, when they need claims to be in, what criteria they'll deny claims for, the filing timeline for appeals, etc. Keeping track of all of this is a bureaucratic nightmare.

I think single payer would streamline a lot of things and save a ton of money in the short term for everyone. But, corruption, decay, and even political maneuvering in government is inevitible, even with the best run systems. Look at the IRS or the USPS.
 

ramblinwreckguru

Ramblin' Wreck
Messages
740
Location
Savannah, GA
Unfortunately, private run payment systems have the same waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia. The healthcare revenue system is absolutely massive and bloated. I worked in that field for a few years, and it's insane how complex simple reimbursements are. Every payer has their own contacts for reimbursements, when they need claims to be in, what criteria they'll deny claims for, the filing timeline for appeals, etc. Keeping track of all of this is a bureaucratic nightmare.

I think single payer would streamline a lot of things and save a ton of money in the short term for everyone. But, corruption, decay, and even political maneuvering in government is inevitible, even with the best run systems. Look at the IRS or the USPS.

I'm sure there's no perfect system, but given a choice between free market healthcare or government healthcare, I'll choose the free market every time.
 

Dress2Jacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
103
Location
Marietta
Some of us would shoot back.

Quick (true) story. A buddy's little league team was at practice and someone got on the PA system to tell everyone in attendance to take shelter or something like that. The police were nearby, chasing an armed miscreant on foot, and the miscreant was heading in the general direction of the baseball fields.

A number of parents left the stands/fields, went to the parking lot, then returned. Armed.
 

684Bee

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,257
Unfortunately, private run payment systems have the same waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia. The healthcare revenue system is absolutely massive and bloated. I worked in that field for a few years, and it's insane how complex simple reimbursements are. Every payer has their own contacts for reimbursements, when they need claims to be in, what criteria they'll deny claims for, the filing timeline for appeals, etc. Keeping track of all of this is a bureaucratic nightmare.

I think single payer would streamline a lot of things and save a ton of money in the short term for everyone. But, corruption, decay, and even political maneuvering in government is inevitible, even with the best run systems. Look at the IRS or the USPS.
That’s because insurance, a 3rd party, is so tied up in everything to do with healthcare.
 

MWBATL

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,793
Unfortunately, private run payment systems have the same waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia. The healthcare revenue system is absolutely massive and bloated. I worked in that field for a few years, and it's insane how complex simple reimbursements are. Every payer has their own contacts for reimbursements, when they need claims to be in, what criteria they'll deny claims for, the filing timeline for appeals, etc. Keeping track of all of this is a bureaucratic nightmare.

I think single payer would streamline a lot of things and save a ton of money in the short term for everyone. But, corruption, decay, and even political maneuvering in government is inevitible, even with the best run systems. Look at the IRS or the USPS.
You make my point for me. Compare the USPS to UPS or FedEx.

I agree that so called private health care is a mess in this country. But go back and examine how that happened. Look at the rules that Medicaid, Medicare and other government regulations have forced onto the private health care systems and you will find your true culprits. We heard the same exact arguments about ObamaCare, that it would bend the cost curve etc. Nope.

But you lose the freedom to choose with single payer, and you choose bureaucracies similar to the CDC and WHO to make health care decisions. THAT is the central issue.

Lies have been used at every turn to push this agenda forward. “If you like your plan, you can keep your plan”. B. Obama. Lies.
 

SnidelyWhiplash

Helluva Engineer
Messages
15,135
Unfortunately, private run payment systems have the same waste, incompetency, corruption, lethargy, inertia. The healthcare revenue system is absolutely massive and bloated. I worked in that field for a few years, and it's insane how complex simple reimbursements are. Every payer has their own contacts for reimbursements, when they need claims to be in, what criteria they'll deny claims for, the filing timeline for appeals, etc. Keeping track of all of this is a bureaucratic nightmare.

I think single payer would streamline a lot of things and save a ton of money in the short term for everyone. But, corruption, decay, and even political maneuvering in government is inevitible, even with the best run systems. Look at the IRS or the USPS.

They all have to adhere to a myriad of different state law requirements in all the areas they do business.
 

LibertyTurns

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,577
That’s because insurance, a 3rd party, is so tied up in everything to do with healthcare.
Insurance is only so lucrative because of the morass of government regulations. If someone could fix that maybe insurance might run to the benefit of those needing or wanting it. It’s worth dreaming about.
 

Dress2Jacket

Jolly Good Fellow
Messages
103
Location
Marietta
Insurance is only so lucrative because of the morass of government regulations. If someone could fix that maybe insurance might run to the benefit of those needing or wanting it. It’s worth dreaming about.

There are multiple non-value-added functions in the economy that could go away entirely, leaving those resources to do something productive IF Uncle Sam would relax his grip. All the back office insurance stuff. 99% of tax accounting (tell me why it takes a U-haul to carry around the tax code and hundreds of thousands of accountants and a large Federal Bureaucracy to manage it?).

There is a lot of money to be made (by someone) if you over-complicate regulations.
 

SnidelyWhiplash

Helluva Engineer
Messages
15,135
Another mass shooting in California - another guy who shouldn’t have been able to legally buy guns, but our judicial system and law enforcement failed us again. Rinse and repeat.

The 44 year old shooter was previously arrested for several crimes including felonies. After serving his sentence, his charges and convictions were expunged. Rinse and repeat.
 

LibertyTurns

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,577
Another mass shooting in California - another guy who shouldn’t have been able to legally buy guns, but our judicial system and law enforcement failed us again. Rinse and repeat.

The 44 year old shooter was previously arrested for several crimes including felonies. After serving his sentence, his charges and convictions were expunged. Rinse and repeat.
They just need another law. Make it really really really really illegal for people to have guns illegally. That should do the trick.
 

SnidelyWhiplash

Helluva Engineer
Messages
15,135
A much better approach is passing no laws at all and hoping the problem goes away on its own. That approach is working really well so far.

Who is advocating that? We’re yelling at the top of our lungs to ENFORCE THE ****ING LAW. (I’m raising my Internet voice at them, not you to be clear.). Laws exist to prevent these things from happening. Why does nobody care that over and over and over and over the justice system and law enforcement do not do their job? There are specific people who approved expunging the shooters record which enabled him to legally buy guns. Just like nearly every other shooting. The guy in Colorado apparently never had his conviction entered into the background check system - someone failed there too. Those people can easily be found out and they should all be held accountable. And going forward, DO YOUR ****ING JOB.
 
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WreckinGT

Helluva Engineer
Messages
1,546
Who is advocating that? We’re yelling at the top of our lungs to ENFORCE THE ****ING LAW. (I’m raising my Internet voice at them, not you to be clear.). Laws exist to prevent these things from happening. Why does nobody care that over and over and over and over the justice system and law enforcement do not do their job? There are specific people who approved expunging the shooters record which enabled him to legally buy guns. Just like nearly every other shooting. The guy in Colorado apparently never had his conviction entered into the background check system - someone failed there too. Those people can easily be found out and they should all be held accountable. And going forward, DO YOUR ****ING JOB.
I would be completely in favor of overhauling the background check system, making it more robust to limit human error and harshly holding those accountable who do not comply with the law. That is one of many common sense things we could do if common sense prevailed over unbridled tribalism. Im pretty sure though that if we proposed any changes to this system at all to try and improve things it would be squashed immediately like every other proposed gun law.
 

SnidelyWhiplash

Helluva Engineer
Messages
15,135
I would be completely in favor of overhauling the background check system, making it more robust to limit human error and harshly holding those accountable who do not comply with the law. That is one of many common sense things we could do if common sense prevailed over unbridled tribalism. Im pretty sure though that if we proposed any changes to this system at all to try and improve things it would be squashed immediately like every other proposed gun law.

Well sadly we'll never know. Because one side is proposing new laws that wouldn't have done anything to prevent the shootings. And the other side is intransigent against doing anything at all.
 

MWBATL

Helluva Engineer
Messages
4,793
Im pretty sure though that if we proposed any changes to this system at all to try and improve things it would be squashed immediately like every other proposed gun law.
I agree. And the folks who would do the squashing are the left wing groups who fight for felons' rights. Those are the people who are making it mandatory to "forgive" the crime in the system so that these poor people are not ruined for life. You unfeeling and uncaring person, you! Oh, and you must be a racist too since most of these folks are POC. <end/sarcasm>
 

LibertyTurns

Helluva Engineer
Messages
5,577
A much better approach is passing no laws at all and hoping the problem goes away on its own. That approach is working really well so far.
No, maybe we can start by enforcing 1 of the laws we currently have instead of adding another law that the criminals will break to the long list of laws they’re already breaking? The criminals keep committing crimes and some Americans just keep making excuses & try to rationalize their bad behavior as anyone’s fault but their own.
 
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